Background: I'm Damien the DM from adventures in Irelia, a collaborative storytelling experience told through a game of dungeons and dragons, part of the Gunnageek network. Just like the show you're checking out now, shows on the network are individually owned, and opinions expressed may not reflect others. Find other epically geeky shows@gunnageeknetwork.com.
Chris Osborne: And welcome to Play comics, where once again, we are here looking at a video game based on a comic property and how well it represents that source material. And today we're pulling in some actual real world source material with it, too, because things are just going to get weird, as I have Michael Bivens here with us to look at Yu Gi oh, the duelist of the roses. Michael, how are you today?
Michael Bivens: I'm doing great. How are you, Chris?
Chris Osborne: I'm super excited for this one because I like history stuff, and somehow we get to talk about Yu Gi oh and british history all at the same time.
Michael Bivens: It's a perfect combination and one that truly diverges greatly from the source material.
Chris Osborne: So what was it that made you see this game and think, oh, I have to come talk about this one?
Michael Bivens: I actually played it when I was a kid, late two thousands, maybe mid two thousands. I played it and could never beat it. I was terrible at it. And then I saw Yu Gi oh was on your list, and I was like, ah, this is perfect opportunity to go back and try again.
Chris Osborne: So it wasn't just rounds and rounds of british history.
Michael Bivens: You know, I do enjoy some good british history, but I think maybe the, the best part about it is just the melting pot of all of what is Yu Gi oh plus the british history, plus, just, like, the total absurdity that is duelist of roses compared to any other yugioh game. That just makes this perfect.
Chris Osborne: What was it that drew you just to Yu Gi oh as a general fandom thing when you were little?
Michael Bivens: It was the English, it was the dubbed release of Yu Gi oh in America. I remember racing home after, after class to watch one of two shows ever. It was Pokemon and Yu Gi oh. I had to run home from, from grade school to see these two shows on the after school special airing time. And, and then at the store seeing yugioh cards. I was like, I gotta have these, you know? And it would be the one thing that I would beg my parents for every time was Yu Gi oh cards. Not that I knew how to play or was competent at all in the game. In fact, today I've played the online client here and there. I don't think I ever win. It's very rare. But I think what really drew me in was it had that feeling of Pokemon, but a little bit darker with the idea of the shadow realm, and it was more. It was a little bit more fantasy based with wizards and sorcerers and monsters and zombies than Pokemon was. And so I think that was one of the big things that drew me in as a young boy. That little bit, slightly more edgy violence that we got from Yu Gi oh than something like Pokemon.
Chris Osborne: Yu Gi oh is something that I just missed out on completely. You don't know this, but as we're recording this one, the next episode that's going to come out is a combo episode looking at the eternal duel of soul and the sacred cards. Even since then, haven't had a chance to get too much deeper into Yu Gi oh. And at this point, I think it just falls into the how do I have time for everything? Category of stuff that I should be experiencing.
Michael Bivens: Yu Gi oh is an insane beast, too. So you have the. There's an original version of a manga, and then the manga got rebooted when fans started writing in, saying they wanted to play the duelist version, because originally in the manga, they played all sorts of different games, and then they switched to, they revamped it for just Yu Gi oh duelist, which is just playing duel monsters because the fan reaction. But then you have the manga that goes through, what's the original Yu Gi oh show. Now, if you look at the Yu Gi oh anime, it's got several iterations of it, and it starts off just playing, you know, playing duelist of people playing cards against each other, and then it slowly evolves into something absurd by the end of the fourth or fifth series. You have time travel, you have dimension jumping, you have cyborgs that are rewriting the timeline. You have four separate dimensions that have to come, come together to defeat the dark overlord. Like, it becomes something absurd from what was originally just like, this egyptian themed shadow games of what it originally was. And so you travel from something that's just like how we're going to twist a little bit of egyptian history to now we have a total cyberpunk war where humanity has been completely wiped out. So it's a. It's crazy, the journey that Yu Gi oh goes on. And also, each series is just very long in itself. And so it is an incredible beast to actually get through everything that's available with Yu Gi oh.
Chris Osborne: I'm gonna have to jump into this now because watching something devolve like that is just one of my favorite things. I mean, it's why I love a bunch of comics, too, because that same kind of thing happens when you have 60, 70 years of continuity to work with. And, oh, that just sounds like so much fun. My wife is going to hate me.
Michael Bivens: There's a great debate in the community about whether or not they actually kept the same thread, and it got very confusing from one series to the next about, are these actually continuations? Is this happening in the future, especially when you get to Yu Gi? Oh, I think Zexel, that's when you start to go, okay, they've made no mention of past characters or events. Is this show still in the same continuity line, or is this supposed to be a different dimension? And so it can get a little hard. And like I said, there's a great divide in the fandom about does this actually all connect or not? And then there's something they do in ARCV, the last series that goes, okay, it is connected. It actually is all one timeline. These masterminds brought it all together. Look at them go. But there's still people that don't think. I don't think they're actually connected.
Chris Osborne: And something that I thought, I mean, when I asked you this, I was not being serious at all, but, like, actually tying in the War of the Roses, like, the real historical thing, I was just kind of. Yeah. Does it have anything to do with that? Because it kind of sounds like it just completely joking, and boom, there it is.
Michael Bivens: Yeah. In fact, it's very blatant. You load into Yu Gi oh due list of roses, and you're immediately set upon the storyline of it, and they are talking about the upcoming invasion and the war between the different families with the Yorks. And. And you have to choose, do you side with Yu Gi or do you side with Seto? And they represent the different sides of the war. And then it's supposed to be, to a degree, a reflection of that war as you progress through the game and defeat your opponents.
Chris Osborne: So how much of the real world War of the Roses history were you aware of before getting into this?
Michael Bivens: About a class in college? Not an in depth class. I'd say that it's something I was aware of, I knew about, and I knew the rough structure of, but by no means could I sit here and write a paper about it. How about yourself, Chris?
Chris Osborne: Just to set the scene here, what we're looking at is just a series of civil wars from 1455 to 1487 in what is now great Britain, mostly between the house of Lancaster, and the house of Tudor House of York is also in there. There's some other people taking sides on stuff, and everybody wants to be king or queen and be in charge. So they're all fighting each other because they think it should be them, basically, most of british history.
Michael Bivens: Yeah, pretty accurate.
Chris Osborne: I mean, let's be real. It's kind of nice to see british people fighting with each other instead of going out and fighting with the rest of the world.
Michael Bivens: And in this Yu Gi oh version, Yugi, to set that stage a little bit more, Yugi represents the head of the Tudors, and so he's essentially Henry Tudor. And then Seto Kaiba represents the yorkist forces as Christian Rosencruise. Not quite sure on how to pronounce that last name, but yeah. So they kind of represent the competing families, and they summon you from the future. Again, more time traveling in the Yu Gi oh universe. Summon you from the future as a great duelist to help one of their sides take on the other in the duelist of roses to see who will be the victor in this great war.
Chris Osborne: Does this kind of thing come up in the manga at all? Like, maybe not the storyline, but something similar?
Michael Bivens: No, not from any of my research. So I haven't watched. I haven't watched myself the two newest series, so I don't know all the nuances, but I've watched. I've read a bunch of recaps and understood it, but the manga actually ends where the first series does too. So the original Yu Gi oh show where that ends, it's the same place the manga ends. The rest of it is just writers in a room for the actual show. I don't think there is any kind of. There's still time traveling and stuff. And I know at one point there's, like, a secret society in the anime, there's a secret society of cyborgs who keep going back in time to rewrite history. So maybe there's that little bit of similarity where there's some time traveling to change history and impact what's. What's in the future. So, like, if you side with Yugi in the game, history progresses as it should, but if you side with Kaiba, then you end up changing history a little bit and you end up summiting this, like, kind of demon thing at the end of the game. So there are some similarities in, like, stuff being pulled from, like, the shadow realm or the world of the undead and some time travel components, but nothing quite to, like, this level of. We need to pull someone from the future to change the future.
Chris Osborne: You said that the original anime ends when the manga ends and there's more series. Does that make all those more series? Is the greatest set of filler episodes in the history of anime.
Michael Bivens: You know, I think Naruto gives them a run for the money. But you might be right in saying that now there is a movie set in the Yu Gi oh timeline that is supposed to actually be a successor to the manga. At least that's what the author has said. But again, it's another alternate timeline. So the Yu Gi oh timeline is just all over the place and it also splits multiple times, converges, and changes. They warp each other. So it's absurd and all over the place.
Chris Osborne: We're going to try to pull all these timelines together while I drop some promos for a few other things.
Too young for this track. The search for booty.
Michael Bivens: Two years ago, we set off on a mission to introduce Tyler to strange new episodes to boldly go where several.
Podcasts have probably gone before.
But then a while back, Troy mentioned there was this one time on Star Trek where everyone was wearing a thong for no reason. And now we have a new mission.
Michael Bivens: To watch the one with the thongs.
But getting there is gonna be a.
Michael Bivens: Little tricky because Tyler doesn't know which episode that is.
I did narrow it down to 50 episodes though, so we'll get there eventually. You can find too young for this track wherever you find podcast.
Hello friends. This is Trottle Power, host of the Treadle Power presents the Power Playthroughs podcast with Toroidal Power, a podcast where I, your hostel power, play through games in a powerful way. And I'm inviting you to listen to toroidal power presents the Power Playthroughs podcast with Toroidal Power, a podcast where I, your hostel power, play through games in a powerful way. You can find it and a lot of other weird shows@probablywork.com.
Chris Osborne: That was some great stuff to check out. But first, let's finish up here. So Michael, the main reason we're here is to look at a 2003 released game for the PS two brought to us by Konami. Developed by Konami, published by Konami. Everything like that. Because Konami is just good.
Michael Bivens: Yeah, it's a phenomenal game. And Konami also just always has hits. There's nothing that Konami puts out that I'm not at least a little bit interested in. They're a great studio and how can you not appreciate them for everything they do? They definitely hit the market for boys and teenagers too. And so that's when I obviously found them and got hooked with all the shonen stuff that they get to be a part of.
Chris Osborne: And like you said before, the basic storyline of this one is pick a side and fight through what they're displaying as the war of the roses. And so they're pulling Yu Gi oh characters into this and replacing the real world people there for the most part. And I think that's just a really interesting way to do this.
Michael Bivens: Pitching this game must have been so fun, too, because they're like, they're going in and they're saying, we have no intention of sticking to the rules of the Yu Gi oh card game. We have no intention of being like the show other than we're gonna take characters, and we have no intention of being like the source material other than, again, taking characters. And so we see a return of characters. Depending on what side you pick, you have to take on the other team. And so you get to see characters like Rex and Weevil return. You see characters like Taya, Tristan, and Mai. All these characters you come to love from the original show, they make an appearance and they all represent themselves. Plus these historical allies of either Henry Tudor or Christian rosencruise.
Chris Osborne: And the fact that they all pretty much have a specific person that they're representing, I think is just a beautiful touch with it.
Michael Bivens: They do a great job of this historical similarities, just enough to scratch a history buff's interest, but not so into it that it's confusing or would be hard to get into if you weren't interested in history at all.
Chris Osborne: Essentially, it's what I would imagine like a Muppets telling of the entire story would be. There's differences and they're going to play some things up, but they're working from a general framework that is relatively accurate.
Michael Bivens: Yeah. And one thing I appreciate is right after the intro, you actually get to see, like, okay, you're sailing from France and you sail into. Into the UK, and then you're like, you're landing there, and then you take this castle from a duelist and it opens up these routes to go to these new castles to take on your next opponent. And so it's really nice to see that there is that real good war aspect of you're taking one castle after another from the opposing team.
Chris Osborne: And I really like that they made this more of a tactics game and not just another instance of let's play the Yu Gi oh card game on your tv. I think that was a real nice touch. And the things that they added in there really made it worth it and not just an aesthetic change.
Michael Bivens: Yeah. The diversion from the rules of Yu Gi oh duelist is very welcomed and very engaging and fun. So I found the game somewhat difficult or very difficult as a child and then as an adult trying to relearn it. Like, I just jumped in without doing any kind of background research, you know, and then I got in and I immediately realized, oh, yeah, there's all sorts of, like, field effects that go into play wherever your characters move around in this tactics, tactics based combat, there's all sorts of, like, hidden effects and ways to fuse monsters that none of which is explained in the game, but there's, there's a lot of great depth and, like, additions to the Yu Gi oh duelist rules that, you know, we don't get to see otherwise. And in the show, I think the closest we get is maybe, like, in the show, in the manga, maybe the closest we get is the dice monsters, where monsters are able to move across the field a certain number of steps and they attack each other, each other that way. And so that's a bit of a stretch to connect the two, but there are some slight elements that are similar between.
Chris Osborne: So how big of a change was this for you, playing this way versus the card game?
Michael Bivens: Oh, it's a total shift. Now. Fusion works entirely different, like fusing your monsters together to create something stronger. And in the card game, it's very cut and dry. This monster can fuse with this monster. To create this monster in the game, you have to change and, like, start, you have to change your way of thinking about fusions and go, okay, any, let's say any plant and zombie can fuse together to create pumpkin. You know, so you actually have these, like, lists that you have to, like, cross compare and try to memorize. And so either that or you can do me what I did and I just kept a list beside me of these types of monsters. Confuse into pumpking. And that's the most important one because he, like, you get pumpking and, and that card is basically just a winner in this game. Like, it's hard to beat him in any, in any match in the game. So it's difficult to transition between the two because while there are some elements that are same of this monster's attack is higher than this monster's attack. You defeat him, you gain, you take out the monster and the opponent loses life points. There's similarities in how you win and lose, but everything in between there is different. And so you have to rethink how you're going to duel and there's a much deeper element of strategy that goes into this because you're also playing with a limited card base. It's nowhere near the limit that you get even in the original version of Yu Gi. Oh, you know, the first few releases that still had far more cards than what's available in this game. So that does work to some benefit of you're able to know that, okay, there's this type of deck, which means there's only these types of monsters. I can anticipate that most likely this car that I can't see has no more attack than this because that's kind of the limit of the game. So there's. There's a lot of differences that make the game in some ways more a deeper tactile or a deeper tactic based element, but it's also easier in some aspects. So it's hard not to just thoroughly enjoy and love this game.
Chris Osborne: One of the big criticisms I saw looking through everything here was that when you get to that second half of the game where you're playing as the other side, it's essentially, hey, let's do this all again.
Michael Bivens: Yeah, there's pretty much going through and redoing it on the opposite team is essentially the same. You're just going to go through the same pathways, you're going to take on the same, you're going to take on people. Now, they have different deck types and so tea has a lot of typically, if you're going to side with Yugi, you're going to take on Rex Raptor first. He's pretty much all dinosaurs. You know what to expect from him. And then if you play against tea, that's who you typically play against first. If you're going to side with Seto Kaiba, she has mostly fairies. And so thankfully there is a difference in, like, deck types, which makes it more interesting, does keep the interest up. But there is. It is a lot of, like, going through the motions. But thankfully the ending is just slightly different enough that it's not entirely the same storyline.
Chris Osborne: I just think it's cool seeing the setting with everything, like the presentation here, putting it on top of those old maps, having the battlefield the way that it is for everything. You can tell that the people who were making this loved the parts of it that they were doing.
Michael Bivens: Yeah, it's clearly that the, especially designers who went in here and the level design and the character design, like, they clearly had a lot of fun in developing this deck and this gameplay and trying to make something really engaging and fresh, something that stands out even to this day, it's a standout game and there's been nothing else like it in the Yu Gi oh universe. And so there's definitely a level of appreciation I have for game developers who are willing to go out of their way to make something different purely for that opportunity of something fresh and fun. And they don't behold themselves too strictly to any kind of source material. I think it's a brave choice that I don't know how many bigger developers would be willing to do today. And I think that's also what lends itself to letting this game stand out.
Chris Osborne: That also kind of makes me wonder if this was just a game that they were making anyway. And then they put Yu Gi oh on top of it. Usually when I say that it's a bad thing, I think this time it's a good thing because they did it really well and they tied everything in really well.
Michael Bivens: I wouldn't be surprised if they did make the basis of this game. And then all of a sudden an executive came along and said, actually I just got the rights to this thing called Yu Gi oh, can you change the character art and change the monsters to be Yu Gi oh things. And then a couple of developers like that sounds awesome. I would not be surprised if that was somewhat similar to the story because like we're saying it is so entirely different from anything else that we saw before or after. And certainly we don't see something like this with Digimon or Pokemon, which we can kind of throw those three in together in the same lot and they've never done anything quite like this either.
Chris Osborne: Yeah, Pokemon has definitely done things that are outside of the main game genre and stuff. Digimon, I'm not sure, but I mean, it's like, let's go take pictures of stuff, let's do the phone thing where you walk around in the real world like it's never anything this ambitious at all.
Michael Bivens: Yeah, and I think it just also truly lends to the developers just how well this game was received and how beloved this game still is. I actually streamed playing this game a little bit and I wasn't expecting anyone to join in because it's a really old PS two game. Who is going to look up on twitch, you know, yu gi oh, duelist of roses. But actually in the four or 5 hours I played I consistently had four people watching the entire way through and I saw that duelist of Roses actually had thousands of people subscribed to it to get notifications if anyone did play the game. So it's actually quite a few people that still really enjoy this game more than just playing it themselves. They're willing to watch someone stream and play it.
Chris Osborne: That's really cool because you don't get a lot of that from games that aren't like the this is a game that's gonna be top five for the rest of time kind of games.
Michael Bivens: Yeah, it just, like I said, it holds up so well, and I think it holds a special place for people that are like me in late twenties, early thirties. I think those of us who played it as a kid and watched the show growing up after school, I think this game just, like, kind of hits you. And because it was so hard, I don't think a lot of people, you know, finished it as a kid. So I think it's. There are games like that that you don't finish as a kid because they're so challenging that they just stick in the back of your mind and you always have a special place in your heart for them.
What is it?
Chris Osborne: Do you think that this one really gets right looking at the game compared to Yu Gi? Oh, the manga.
Michael Bivens: I think what it gets right compared to the manga. So the manga was willing to kind of go out on this crazy limb and be much darker and much more serious. Like, in the manga, we have people that they just. Their souls get taken away from them. They die in the manga, and we don't see that in the anime. So the stakes feel so much higher. And I think artificially we feel that the stakes are much higher in this game too, because we're talking about a real war in our history, in this alternate timeline's history. And there's much higher stakes that you're playing for, whether you're taking the path of the hero or the path of selfishness and siding with either Yugi or kaiba. There's a much more seriousness to these battles. You're affecting the future of the world depending on your actions here. And I think that's what it is. I think the show does a good job of keeping it dark, but not as dark as the manga. And so I think these three properties share that of being dark and serious. But I think the difference between this and what ties this to the manga is the seriousness of the conflict you're playing through.
Chris Osborne: And obviously, you can look at they're playing this card game and they play the card game in the manga. You can get all the superficial things like that, but just the high stakes of it. I think tying this to an event that happened in our real world just really nails home how serious they're all seeing how this is. I can look at Pokemon, and, okay, it's either, oh, they're just having fun fighting their monsters against each other, or people that go the complete opposite side and compare it all to cockfighting and dogfighting, which I think is a little insane. But here with Yu Gi oh, you're doing this with nothing that you would ever consider a pet or anything, for the most part. So just having it here with this real world connection, I think just really hammers home. They're taking this completely seriously, and they want to be the best, and they want to beat everybody. And if somebody has to die along the way, then sucks for them.
Michael Bivens: I'll say that. I don't know. Kuribo. Kuribo is a pretty cute little monster in Yu Gi oh. And I might actually want that one as a pet, but for the most part, most of these creatures are dark and evil, and I wouldn't want them anywhere near me. Now, I'm also gonna say another similarity, I think, is that the thing with the manga is it goes off on such a limb and has so many different styles of games that go on through it, especially the original version. There's at one point even, like, a D and D version that they're playing for the souls of their friends. And so I think if we look at the manga, it's. It's not unbelievable that a game like duelist of roses could have actually been played in the manga. It would not have happened in the tv show, because it's just, you know, the. The tv show wants to focus entirely on Yu Gi oh, duelist. So it can sell us those cards, but this game could have totally and 100% happened in the manga.
Chris Osborne: What do you think this one gets wrong compared to the manga?
Michael Bivens: I think if we were sticking to the manga rules, we would have. When we defeat these duelists as we're going through this war, their souls would be banished to the shadow realm, or they would just straight up be killed. Because the manga does not shy away from violence at all. It is not afraid to do it. And so I think that's one part, is they could have made this game even darker and saying, ah, you've now banished mai to the shadow realm. Her soul is forever gone and departed. I think that's, like, the biggest thing, that if you wanted to stick to the manga source material, you'd have to go darker. You'd have to be willing to say that you killed or banished this person's soul to the shadow realm to. To really tie it in. But beyond that, I don't know if there's too much that you could say that they got wrong from the manga. Other than, you know, these characters are not exact replicas of what you see in the manga.
Chris Osborne: This one is just such a departure. I mean, I'm with you. There can't really be too much different from everything that I've seen because they're essentially making a movie of all of this. And, I mean, that's like saying that the Ember island players are inaccurate. If you're watching Avatar, the last Airbender, like, it's not really supposed to be super accurate.
Michael Bivens: Yeah, I completely agree with what you're saying there. Great call out, though, to avatar. Love, ember island players.
Chris Osborne: Anytime you get a chance to throw them into something, you have to do it.
Michael Bivens: You always have to throw an avatar when you can.
Chris Osborne: If you had somebody who wanted to get into Yu Gi oh, would you give them this game as a bit of a primer course?
Michael Bivens: Oh, that is a great question. Um, I don't think so. I think that I would probably start them off with the manga, and I wouldn't start them at the beginning of the manga. I'd start them with the reboot of the manga because that is where it takes off and where a lot of money starts showing up and where the popularity rose and it's what gave birth to everything else. I think if I started them off with this, first of all, I'd have to give them a very in depth discussion of the hidden mechanics that are never explained and can make your life so much easier when you play this game. But if they played this and then went off to do anything else in the Yu Gi oh universe, they would be, like, confused and would, you know, I think they would set up this anticipation for this in depth tactics combat game, and it is truly unique and one of a kind. There is nothing else that we get like this. And so I don't think it would be the best intro for anyone into what is Yu Gi oh.
Chris Osborne: If I was going to use this, I think it would have to be a super, super niche case and a giant history nerd. And I would definitely be sitting there with them telling them this isn't how the game is going to play in the game throughout the entire time. We're just here for the vibes.
Michael Bivens: Yeah, I can absolutely agree with you. If I was trying to convert someone who was like a really big tactic team, like, they loved Final Fantasy tactics, then I would say, well, here's that? But with Yu Gi. Oh, monsters. Get a little intro here, and then we can see what happens. If you enjoy the vibe of the characters, then we can talk about going further into maybe the show or then to the manga.
Chris Osborne: And finally, if you could add a new end boss, like the secret end boss, but it had to be a muppet, and it couldn't be animal. Which Muppet would you pick? Because I know that would have been your first pick.
Michael Bivens: Oh, man. Um. Gosh, I do love the Muppets. Gosh. Let me think here about who would be the best character for this. I think, obviously, people would love Kermit. I think that would be great. But that's not who I think I would go with. Gonzo. Gonzo the great. I am talking Gonzo. Yeah. I think Gonzo would be hilarious and very chaotic to play against there, either him or. I also think Beaker the scientist one. I also think that he would have a really chaotic game style and would introduce a whole nother level of difficulty to the game in trying to anticipate his moves. And I feel like his AI would be set to max difficulty, and his deck would just consist of this abundance of different typings of monsters yet that somehow all tie together and work, and then there would be just crazy fusions from him to deal with.
Chris Osborne: Gonzo makes complete sense. Beaker came out of nowhere to me, if they could do it the way you're saying, oh, that would be so much fun.
Michael Bivens: It would be one heck of a difficult final secret boss.
Chris Osborne: Well, Michael, it has been great talking to you about all of this. If people want to hear more from you, where else can they find you around the Internet?
Michael Bivens: Oh, gosh, so many places. So the two things that I'll plug is, if you're into Disney stuff in Lorcana, which is the Disney trading card game my fiance and I play every week. And then we have a podcast that goes over it. It's called Quest for five. We'll watch a movie and share card ideas, or we'll talk about the latest news. It's a fan podcast, not an expert podcast. So if you're looking for strategies, not quite the space for you, but we have a lot of fun talking about the game that we both love dearly. And then I have alcove. You can find me@patreon.com alcovepod. This is my main kind of creative space, and it's all done with the belief that or the creative philosophy of nobody cares. And so I don't have to worry about public perception. And I just make what I want to make. And so my main series is every Saturday I sit down with a list of topics and a cup of coffee. And whichever one ends first ends the show. I do other things like audio documentaries, game journals. We'll talk about like a game and then review what I really liked about it. And then I kind of just have a menagerie of different types of episodes that'll come out on the occasional Wednesday when I have something I'm really interested in. So there's tons of things to check out. You can find everything on my personal website, msbivens bivens.com. everything is listed there and takes you to all the different places that I am on the Internet.
Chris Osborne: And as always, we'll have links to all that stuff down in the show notes because clicking links is so much easier than trying to remember how to spell things.
Michael Bivens: Oh, yes, absolutely. Thank you so much, Chris. This has been a great time.
Chris Osborne: Hey, it's great to have you on again. You know, when people want to come back, that's just a sign to me that I'm putting together a good show.
Michael Bivens: Yeah, I mean, it's so much fun to get to compare the source material for properties that you're so interested in with the expanded universe of it. There's just, it's a unique little, it's a very fun little twist that you get to do.
And as always, if you want to hear more from me, the best place to do that is to head on over to playcomics.com, where there's links to all the social media things. Mostly I've been hanging out on Twitter because, I don't know, I'm stuck in my ways like a crazy old man.
Chris Osborne: Yeah, that's what we're going to go with.
If you want to be on the show yourself, there's a link in the show notes. You can go be a guest. It links to a page on the website, which makes sense, where there's links to all the games that I'm looking to get booked the soonest. Definitely something you should check out for yourself. Or if you know somebody else that you think would be good for the show, tell them to check it out. It's really good. And, you know, link down in the show notes because links are easy. It's a fun thing to do. If you want to help support the show, the best thing you can do is to share it with other people, make sure that they know about it. Or you can be like Dan McMahon or on a lit class and give the show money. That's always cool too. But definitely, you know, just share it with people. It's fun. Make sure that they listen to it. It's a good time. I'm not biased at all. If you want some other wonderfully geeky shows, head on over to Guinea Geek.com. because guess what? Play Comics is a part of the Guineek.com network where, oh, my goodness, there's other wonderfully geeky shows.
Chris Osborne: Wow.
Who would have thought that I'm actually on one of those other wonderfully geeky shows. It's called Legends of Shield, and we right now are taking a look at evolution. And then when Agatha all along starts up, we're gonna start looking at Agatha, because that has been the plan. You guessed it all along. If you like the music that I'm rudely talking on top of right now, head on over to backingtrack GG, and check out the place where I got this new music from. And I hope you like it, because I spent a really, really long time editing it down from three minutes to as long as you're hearing it here, which may or may not be the whole three minutes. I haven't decided how I'm gonna do it at the end, but you definitely heard the editing at the beginning. And as always, just grab a game, grab a stack of comics, and go find yourself a new favorite character.